Meeting_2006-01-02

Meeting setup

Date: 02.01.2006
Time: 09.30 Norw. time
Place: Wherever we are : -)
Tools: iChat, SubEthaEdit, phone

Agenda

Opening, agenda review
Reviewing the task list from two weeks ago
Documentation - divvun.no
Corpus gathering
Corpus infrastructure
Linguistics
name lexicon infrastructure
Other issues
Summary, task lists
Closing

1. Opening, agenda review, participants

Opened at 09: 55.

Present: Børre, Maaren, Saara, Sjur, Thomas, Trond

Absent: Tomi (sick leave until Jan. 17th)

Main secretary: Sjur

Agenda accepted as is.

2. Reviewing the task list from the last meeting

Børre

Gather public texts
- Not done
Continue converting text from input format to our xml
- Some done
Document the corpus infrastructure
- Not done
review code and documentation for corpus xsl files under version control
- Not done
review the convert2xml.pl script, what works well and what doesn´t.
- Done
comment review template made by Saara
- Not done
proper names meeting to arrive at final xml format
- Done
fix bugs!

Maaren

work with risten.no
- not done, I have been very, very lazy
review corpus usage documentation, and the usage of the corpus
- not done
discuss with relevant people regarding seminar on proofing tools, normativity and SGL in February
- discussed with Laila (SGL) about seminar

Saara

Look at the corpus infrastructure issue
Convert the name lexicon from present format to xml
- not done
discuss the new lexicon format in the newsgroup
Language detection for the corpus files
- almost done
Implement addition of <hyph> tags to the converted corpus files
- done
Do some testing for bug #211
- not done
update the convert2xml script according to the comments
- some xsl-handling still needed
add version control of the corpus xsl files to the (upload) processing
- RCS access things have to be solved first.
xml2lexc update to handle complex names: construct entries like we have now from the different parts of a complex name entry
- not done
update preprocess to handle inflected forms of complex names
- not yet optimal
fix bugs!

Sjur

Lule Sámi twol problems, with Thomas and Trond
- nothing
follow up on voice group-chat not working to Sámediggi
- Test Marratech when the new Marratech server is in place
  - waiting for the server
Follow up on place names from Norge Digitalt
- write an e-mail to or call Bjørn Olav Megard
  - last info: he has not forgotten it, but has not succeeded in bringing it up with Øystein Johannessen.
Evaluate SFST as speller (and analyzer) lexicon
- more thorough analysis than was possible in Guovdageaidnu
write a background document on the corpus contracts
- not done
proper names meeting to arrive at final xml format
- conducted the meeting, important progress made, and results posted to the newsgroup
write public tender documents
- Selection criterion document updated and sent to the project board - almost final
fix bugs!
other:
- worked more with risten.no/eXist and the parallel editing bug - still no progress

Thomas

work on North Sámi compounding and derivation
- worked and still working
review corpus usage documentation
- begun
smj G3 issue with Sjur and Trond
- not anything this week

Tomi

On sick leave.

Trond

project planning with Sjur, continued
- Not after last meeting
Work on the G3 bug issue with Sjur and Thomas, carry it over to sme.
- Not done.
document corpus infrastructure, your part
- documented tags only.
review corpus usage documentation
- Read things
comment review template made by Saara
- Not done
discuss the new lexicon format in the newsgroup
- Done.
proper names meeting to arrive at final xml format
- Participated.
fix bugs!

3. Documentation

Reviews

Add documentation on our corpus infrastructure and our corpus work in general ( Børre, Tomi, Trond, Saara). For the basic corpora, we need 2 additional types of documentation, or doc for 2 target groups:

For the users/linguists: What corpus are found, how do I use them (this info is now scattered). (Part of the HOWTO USE is documented in the catxml docu, what documents are found where etc + an overall documentation is not written, since the corpus is so sparsely populated)
1. catxml done, which is what is needed mostly. Do we need more?
2. Review: Thomas, Maaren, Linda, Ilona, Trond

Review setup and reporting to be posted to the newsgroup, possibly a summary in our documentation.

Deadline for reviews: by next meeting.

Catxml review: this should be based on the new tool made by Tomi (C++ version), called ccat. Tomi will install it, and announce it in news when ready for review.

Update: Tomi is on sick leave, and Saara will make the tool available in Tomi's absence.

4. Corpus gathering

Contracts

Next step:

wait for comments from the lawyers - remind them of the task? ( Sjur, Trond)
possibly update contracts with remarks from lawyers
start using them!

Collecting

Nothing new, now hampered by the lawyers checking the final version of the contracts.

We want both parallell and errouneous (unproofed) text files. Børre to contact the Odin guy.

5. Corpus infrastructure

Updated task list:

Include the xsl files under version control
1. RCS version control is almost finished, but an issue with access control is still open. Discussed a bit in the meeting, but nothing conclusive. We'll continue the discussion in the newsgroup.
Incorporate language detection as part of the corpus processing (Saara)
1. Almost finished. Some heuristics regarding other Sámi languages in the same document to be added.
we need a way to deal with hyphenated documents (documents with (manually) inserted hyphenation marks) in catxml/preprocess.
1. done, needs review (Saara)
we need to review whether only automatic hyphen detection is good enough, or whether manual post-processing in some form is needed. Delayed until we have some results to base the review on.
1. Acceptable results: 90% of all real hyphens correctly tagged.
CGI-admin script to add xsl-file to a corpus file that doesn't have one ( Tomi)
1. Saara will review the existing code, consult Tomi, and try to make a script to help Børre utilize the template and the infra in place.

6. Linguistics

North Sámi

three-part compounds issue still open
- Thomas is finished with three-part compounds for North Sámi.
  - compilation time has increased to 10m for the sme parser as a whole. This is probably linked to the three-part issue, but we are not sure about that.
  - it overgenerates wildly. This is bad for several of our applications.
- compound shortening issue is waiting for the SGL to make a normative decision
  - we have to wait until SGL´s meeting protocol (???) is ready
- linguistic analysis/discussion to continue in the newsgroup
- we should include the members-to-be of the Sámi Giellalávdegoddi (SGL) in this discussion, but how? We need a common meeting / normativity seminar / seminar on proofing issues and on language technology in a broader sense with them. Then we also need to open the linguistic issues newsgroup we talked about earlier, and set up their computers and teach them to use the newsgroup. This seminar needs to include the Lule Sámi section of SGL (others are welcome too).
  - Laila has informed the members of the SGL about this. This is very okei - open the linguistic issues newsgroup for the members of SGL, but we have to know how to do it. Seminar also very okei, but we have to wait until the new SGL is elected.
- Timetable:
  - The Sámediggiráđđi is going to appoint new members in January ( Johan Mikkel Saara is asking people)
  - Contact the SGL when it is elected, and ask them to arrange a normativity seminar, with invited keypersons. Have to wait until it is elected. Initially we planned for February, but it is too early, because SGL is not elected yet. Divvun wants the seminar as early as possible.
number project still open (see below)
diphthong simplification/G3 issue should be carried over from Lule Sámi.
- TODO:
  - Trond, Thomas and Sjur to discuss this this month.
  - Writing the rules (copy from smj, adjust) (Sjur, Thomas and Trond)
  - Bug 77 - clearify whether háliid is acceptable - it is found, thus we need to be able to analyse it, but only as !SUB:

Lule Sámi

Open tasks:

Derived G3 that looks like G2 are still open.
- Thomas, Trond and Sjur should meet again to finish the rest.

Numerals

The following North Sámi linguistic issues should be settled before going into the numeral project:

Three-part compounds
Diphthong simplification
Derivation

These issues are recently done in Lule Sámi, and it is more efficient to complete them in North Sámi directly thereafter instead of beginning a new topic

Numeral treatment is on different level in the existing sme and smj parsers, but the issue itself is common to the two langauges, and should therefore be treated in parallel.

Numerals in North Sámi: Inventory is listed elsewhere.

Numerals in Lule Sámi: There are 70 lines of code setting up the structure for case inflection of basic numerals.

7. Name lexicon infrastructure

Summary: see the newsgroup

Complex names

Task list for this issue:

find eventual unique second-parts (B-parts of names that do not exist in isolation): Take the 1.126 version, remove the non-last parts, and compare the B-parts of proper-complex.xml with the simplex forms in 1.126. Non-hits should then be removed from the current propernoun-sme-lex.txt.
- No unique B-parts found, nothing removed. Task closed.
make sure xml2lexc can handle complex names in ways compatible with our present tool chain (=reconstruct the lexc format we have now) (Saara)
- Tomi is working on a C++ version of the xml2lexc tool. He will put it into CVS soon (it is actually catxml, can easily be adopted to the xml2lexc requirements)
the resulting file format should be identical to our present prop-name file (=lexc), that can then be converted to our new xml format using the same script as for the regular names (Tomi or Saara, but only when the technical details are settled)
The core issue: The preprocess script can handle uninflected (A + B) compounds, but not (A + inflected B). Saara will add the analyzer as part of the preprocess, to be able to handle inflected cases as well.

XML format

We had our meeting, and the result was pretty close to the structure of the existing riste.no term base. Now the conversion script to xml needs to be updated. The new format is documented in the newsgroup.

Tasks:

update conversion from lexc to xml to reflect new xml format
testing of conversion
continue the discussion of the name lexicon format ( Saara, Tomi, Sjur, Trond)
implement a prototype in eXist
eXist as editor:
1. develop the needed XQueries and interface
2. synchronisation between risten.no and
3. test whether eXist as editor is actually working well

8. Other

Seminars

SGL/normativity seminar
- all members = potentially/likely all languages
- date? As early as possible, but not likely before the end of February
- place? Maaren will investigate
project meeting
- date: soon, (third)/last week of January? Last week best for Maaren
- place: Tromsø?
we'll return to these next week, and make decissions about our own meeting then

Technical issues

The mac os / perl bug (at least Trond and Sjur has it, Bugzilla #211):
- utf8 "\xC4" does not map to Unicode at /Users/trond/gt/script/preprocess line 82. This msg did not show up in 10.3 (perl 5.8.1), but does so in 10.4 (perl 5.8.6). It is probably a perl - OS mismatch. (Trond, Saara, Tomi)
- Test: the result of the last line should indicate whehter this is a problem in cat or a Perl/OS mismatch.

   preprocess file_name.txt OK
   cat file_name.txt | preprocess !!
   catxml file_name.xml | preprocess ??

Bug fixing

28 open bugs (and 25 risten.no bugs)

Move Bugzilla

Bugzilla now works at the old URL http://giellatekno.uit.no/bugzilla/.

9. Summary, task list